The Creation of Joy: Keeping Our Motives Pure

CREATION FOR JOY: Keeping our motives pure

What is your motive? To Create and share ‘JOY’; Acquiring Money, Prestige or Power; Survival etc.


Today I sat down in my own personal quiet space and contemplated my life; where I have been, where I am now, and where I am heading.    The prime concern limiting my creative energy at the moment is mostly about my financial situation and what I need to do to share my experiences and realisations about healing with the world and so my thoughts drifted to the meaning of money and the motive for creative work.

I recalled three occasions as a student and in my early years of practice that I had less than $1.00 in my bank account and then many years since living on my own where I barely had anything more than perhaps a few thousand dollars to live off and I was surviving literally day by day or week to week, trusting that all would be well.   Yet always my basic needs were taken care of and I really did actually have enough to learn and grow and carry out my life purpose (which involved healing or educating people how to self-heal).  Later on, In my two marriage relationships and their separations (one earlier and one currently sorting itself out) I even reached a point where I was (and am) in the red – in debt, because any moneys I did have was under the control of another person unwilling to share it fairly (at least initially) and so I was and have been forced to seek legal advice just to get a fair settlement of assets for all parties concerned.   This is all to do with fully understanding and owning my power and learning how to share with others who have similar honesty, integrity and purpose, and not to wastefully and unwisely give it to those who are going to misuse and abuse it (i.e. to care and share on many levels, not just physically, without allowing oneself to be taken advantage of so to speak).

I thought then of all the countless legal cases where two people who are considered to love one another have to fight it out in courts just to get a fair settlement when if motive was pure (i.e. when we are interested in other people’s well-being and in spreading joy rather than fulfilling selfish needs out of all proportion to reality where one gains to the detriment of the other) then everything could have easily been settled from the start without any hassle whatsoever.   We never really stop loving someone simply because a relationship ends (but this itself is another topic).  We simply move off in different directions dependant on our life path and both people in a relationship should be able to move on happy in themselves and in the knowledge that the other person has the resources to happily move on also.  If people do truly care and are thinking of another person’s well-being why then are people not able to admirably sort out challenges so all parties are content and happy with the outcome?   But both parties need to have pure motive for this to actually occur.   It all comes down to a question of motive and if we truly investigate our motive, we will see that in many cases, we may have shifted (often without us even realising it) our motive from something pure and healthy (and which has everyone’s best interests at heart) to one which isn’t.   Thus, if both parties’ motives are no longer looking out for the other then it will always result in some form of external mediation in order to sort out differences; the outcome of which is usually something which should technically benefit both parties.

On reflecting on my past life experiences up until the present moment I contemplated my own motives.  In my work my motives are purely to the best of my ability to help people heal or teach them the skills to learn how to self-heal in the shortest time but for the optimal long term good.   In relationships my goal was to share all of myself and what I have for the benefit of both parties so that the outcome is health and wellness for all.  Whenever I make a decision, I ask myself if what I am doing is not only healthy for me, but also my partner, other people and the whole to which we belong.  I carefully weigh up the positive benefits and the negative ones to make sure it is a healthy decision for each party to the best of my ability; and if I make a mistake, I try to learn from it so as not to make the same mistake twice.    By benefits I mean benefits to a persons inner and outer growth, awareness and health (i.e. inner real-self needs) rather than their outer materialistic wants. We need to be mindful of healthy (positively responsive) and unhealthy (negatively reactive) needs because sometimes the separative (lower egotistical) selfish self, reacts negatively to things that actually will improve health and relationships for all, especially if it requires effort or a selfless change in perspective.   We need to remember that just because we may not like a “truth” doesn’t necessarily mean its not good for us.   I am not talking here about pleasing people’s lower ego’s but rather supporting what is right for all.    Our motives can give us a clue to understanding our responses or reactions to life circumstances and thus help with a balanced perspective.

So – why do I find myself where I am in a situation where although in myself (and in my knowledge of who I am as a multidimensional being) I am very healthy, happy and content and have numerous philosophical and practical resources available for healing, self-awareness and self-healing – I have literally no money, very little work, and little motivation to charge into the world to promote myself and to get life moving forward and therefore make a positive difference?

People might be quick to suggest that I am just not good with business and with making money and to perhaps suggest that I do some marketing courses etc.  I have actually investigated some of this and although I can see that the marketing strategies are sound and logical and seem to fit the present economic status of the world, I simply don’t agree with most of them and can’t operate this way.  Why?  Because I don’t agree with the motive behind the current materialistic economical state of the world.  I don’t believe (except in a few cases) it is operating from the correct motive.   It occurs to me, on deeper contemplation, that it is not the marketing strategies specifically I have issues with, it’s the motive behind them.   It is not money I have issues with either, it is the motive behind its use.  In science and health – it’s not the scientific method I have issues with but the use of this method to limit and confine our skills and abilities (and distract us from truth) rather than to free and expand our minds, practical skills to understand more truth.

People in society have become so distracted with material and market forces that the whole purpose and motive for life and living has been neglected, resulting in confusion and suffering.  It is this misplaced motivation I have no interest in and this is why I have not motivation to help (or otherwise get involved) if it is only to further propagate these forces.   For example, I can’t tell people to come in for numerous unnecessary treatments just to fit a business marketing model (motive) when one or two treatments suffice to either resolve the issue or to arm a person with the tools to continue to self-heal.   Treat people well and they don’t need to come back very often but this motive of truly helping helps little with financially sustainability and survivability (in todays present business model).    It seems contrary to the way the world runs.   Yet I know I still have to interact in this world as it is.  How can I interact in the world yet maintain honesty and integrity of purpose (motive) – without sacrificing these values simply to survive, make ends meet, or be successful.   This is the question!

I realised that I do actually have interest in helping people who truly want help but it seems people do not even recognise true help because they themselves are distracted by market forces and cannot see and differentiate between those who can actually help (i.e. are of pure motive) and those who simply claim they can help yet can’t actually deliver (other than superficially or symptomatically perhaps in the case of health – dealing with effects as is often done and not underlying causes).  It seems many people would rather sacrifice healthy values to chase after things which bring no true joy.  I therefore technically do have motivation for, and the resources to share with, anyone whose motivation is also one of joy, self-awareness, growth and healing.   But how does one compete with the marketing hype promising benefits but at exorbitant price?   The simple truth seems so relatively unimpressive (initially) that it seems to bypass people’s attention as they chase what they think will help rather than what actually may help.   Some marketers may say if you don’t put a sufficiently high price on something then we are not valuing our work but this is a flawed concept (a complete illusion) based as it is on a motive of monetary gain and not one of true JOY and SHARING – which if we did not need money with which to live would be given completely free for all to benefit.   So – let us explore motive in a little more depth and get to the simple truth of the matter.

  1. The Ideal: Creating for the Joy of it.

Consider a little child when he (or she) is creating something out of the materials he is provided.  Let us take money out of the equation all together and imagine we live in a world where we do not work and live for money.

Imagine we place before the child a lump of clay (or a paper and pencils, paints or any other material or substance of the universe, spiritual, mental, emotional, physical etc) with which he can creatively work to build into form.  What will the child do with this material? What will he create?

Inside the child is a sea of pure (unmanifested) creative energy.  This energy wells up within him and he is inspired to create something, anything!   It does not really matter what it is but he starts exploring the possibilities and experiments with the clay and builds something.

Now – why does he create at all? What is his motive?

It is simply for the JOY of it!  It is for the JOY of creation itself that he creates.  This is the purpose.   Does he do it for money?  Does he do it for power or prestige? Does he do it because he is forced to do it or even to please someone? No! No! and No!  Ideally, he has simply provided the mater with which to work and perhaps the suggestion to create anything he wants to out of it.

To the child he finds enjoyment and joy in the simple act and process of creation.

Then, perfect or not, and excited about his creation what does he naturally want to do with it?  He wants to SHARE it.   So, off he runs to his parents or friends and shares with them his creation; “Mum, Dad… look at what I have made!”

Now – at this point, we may ask how his parents (or friends) should respond for optimal support? Well.  They simply ALLOW the child the opportunity to express and share his creation.  Interested or not (i.e. whether it is what they would do with the clay or not themselves or if they like it or not) they know it’s important for the child and the child is excited about it, so they smile and allow him to express and share.  The child feels his joy expanded because he feels this loving allowance of his creation to be shared and received.  Even if the creation is not perfect, the parents and friends support him and if they offer advice, it will be of the positive supportive, encouraging kind which allows further growth, expansion and development (i.e. is constructive) rather than the negative kind which shuts down the creative outflow in the child (i.e. destructive – which may contribute to his energy to become stifled bottled up, supressed or blocked resulting in all sorts of self-esteem, confidence or other issues to later arise).

E.g. “well done…Great job… Oh, what about…. Have you thought about or tried this…? etc”.

Definitely not: “What a waste of time and effort…That is horrible…or useless…Don’t bother me…etc”.

This positive response is something we are all capable of applying if we simply bother to try and practice (I.e. by keeping our motives pure, valuing sharing and thinking about the health of others).  To apply it means the receivers motive is also one of sharing JOY and is considerate of the well-being of others.  We always should practice finding a way to communicate effectively for the well being of others and mindful of their reactions or responses for optimal health and growth.

Again, motive enters into other peoples’ response to the creator and the creation.  Is the Motive to uplift, inspire, enhance? In which case it will be supportive, constructive and useful advice, feedback and response (selfless).  Or – is the motive negative, harsh, cruel and essentially selfish which has the effect of berating the child and of shutting the child down in come way, making them feel inadequate, ashamed or otherwise horrible about it.


  1. The motive of gaining money (or other acquisitions – mental, emotional or physical).


Or other temptations such as power, prestige, qualifications, social status, fame, love, affection, intellectual knowledge and so in, all done for selfish (taking or acquiring), reasons rather than selfless (sharing) ones.

Imagine we are the creator (as the child above is) of some creation and someone becomes interested in our creation (be it an object, a service, an educational course etc) and offers us some money for it.   In an ideal state we would be happy enough with the fact that others are enjoying our creation and want to acquire it or learn how to build it into their own lives.   The fact that it makes us money matters not in the big picture because the joy is in the creating and sharing.  Its like a gift shared with anyone who is willing to receive it.  If someone offers something in exchange (other than the joy of receiving the gift) then it’s a bonus.   Remember, from a spiritual perspective, money is simply energy and energy in this world is meant to be shared for the welfare of all.   It is simply an energy exchange and when it is done in proportion and with right motive or intent then all is well and good.   So – as long as the motive remains pure then this is all healthy and everything will work out fine.

However – this is where our motive can shift slightly without us even recognising it has done so and if we allow this subtle shift then we can be subtly distracted from our true motive to… ‘something else!!!’   In this case our motive may shift from the ‘joy of creating and sharing to the motive of ‘making money’.  This shift can be very subtle but highly significant.

If our motive shifts to making money, from one perspective our motive shifts from one of ‘giving’ to one of ‘taking’ and thus if we are not careful this could turn into a motive of ‘Greed’!

Furthermore, we may decide that our creation is worth a lot of money and so decide to add a hefty fee to its acquisition – perhaps one not in balanced accord with a mutual fair energy exchange (where both parties and happy and one does not feel ‘ripped off or abused’).

The result of this slight shift of motive may be two-fold in its consequences.

  1. A) upon the creator (supplier) and B) upon the receiver (purchaser).

Now – as said above there is nothing wrong with receiving moneys for a product because in this world where we all need money to live, we have to at least, at the minimum, meet our needs but – it must be carefully balanced so the motive is still pure and one of sharing and not to negate the JOY of giving and receiving.   For example, if the price is a hefty one (out of all proportion) then the motive is not one of spreading (sharing) pure JOY but is one tinged with a certain amount of taking (greed).

This means that now the joyful creative energies behind the creation may not be fully there anymore (depending on how tinged with greed it is 1-100%).  If the motive shifts entirely then essentially the creation is now an empty shell of its former self, devoid of healthy life energy and although the purchaser acquires the creation, its energy is somewhat depleted (gift wrapped emptiness so to speak – or a shift from ‘joy-creation’ to ‘greed-tinged creation’).   At any rate it is no longer as vitalised and pure as it once was because the joy is now tinged with greed and the desire to make money (a mixture, perhaps, of both).

The creator may righteously justify their fee by saying something like “look – you have here a beautiful creation with which to use.  You should thank me and its worth every penny.  It seems like a lot but you will benefit from its value”.  In essence, the product no longer able to speak for itself (as it is) and now has to be sold and bargained for.  People have to be now manipulated into buying it whether they sometimes even want it or not.  Does this sound familiar in the modern-day marketing world for commodities and goods?

To the receiver it is as if JOYFUL creation now has to be bought at a price and therefore is tinged with poison.   If the receiver is struggling to survive, then they may acquire the object or service but at a cost too heavy to bear.  So – yes, perhaps they get some benefit from the product but attached to it may also be some internal resentment at having to part with so much to acquire it; and which resentment may eat away at them over time, added to by other similar taking or abusive experiences until this bottled up resentment manifests as a health issue.  The purchasing of said object now has become a chore or burden rather than a blessing (thus diminishing their inspiration from it perhaps – if they allow themselves to take this negativity on).

So, rather than a mutual exchange of energy (i.e. conservation of transfer of energy) give-give exercise, it is now a give-take exercise where one benefits to the detriment of the other (as in the legal case example mentioned earlier in the introduction).

For us – the creator of the creation – if the motive shifts from ‘Sharing the JOY of creation’ to ‘making money’ we may drive ourselves to make more and more of our creation to make more and more money (driven you may say to acquire money, power, prestige, popularity etc) endlessly repeating the same process day by day, week by week, year by year until one day we realise we are in a repetitive rut and although we may have a lot of material acquisitions, we realise that we are now inwardly starved and poor of vitality, life energy and inner joy.   Wasting all those years and for what?

The end result is lack of vitality and creative energy due to lack of pure motive (and perhaps the confusion of realising that I have all this money – so how and where did I go wrong?).

To the extreme, this is the process results in bleeding of the many of their life energies for the gain of the one or the few (i.e. selfishness).  Again – does this sound familiar?  For example – every year inflation (which we are assured is a good thing) raises costs and as a consequence everyone puts their prices up more also.   In effect, although our individual pay cheque is more, we are paying more for everything else (many commodities all risen in collectively in price) and thus the individual rise is not enough to cover the difference.  So, we have more (apparent) money but it is less effective in its spending.  The rich thus get richer and the poor poorer.  People drop under the comfortable survivability line and the stress of keeping up takes its toll.   The people are told this is all good (i.e. growth) for the economy but the practical reality doesn’t quite add up (except for those who can capitalise on it, being so called successful businesses, who have perhaps acquired money for moneys’ sake whilst simultaneously bleeding consumers who need the creations but cannot continue to afford it).   This is a result of confused motives which claims it has the interests of the people at heart and doesn’t even realise that it is these very confused motives that are creating more depletion, lack and increasing stress to survive.    I realise not all big business have confused their motives and some may have maintained their integrity but I suspect many have subtly or even obviously have a motive driven by pure greed or the need for acquisitions (many in the name of doing good).

  1. Motive of Survival:

Consider now a third category of people; a third option in this material world in which we live.  Consider a person, well meaning and desiring to create and share with JOY but due to the pressures of surviving in the world has not the resources to do what he (or she) loves to do (as described above where the material forces have contributed to a go…go…go…world where everyone is running around like headless chooks acquiring more money, more degrees, more knowledge – the list goes on and judging their success by their material acquisitions – at any cost rather than in sharing and spreading joy, health, wellness etc at an affordable cost for the well-being of all).

Motive has now shifted from ‘Creating and sharing JOY’ to a motive of ‘survival’.

In order to make ends meet this person has to go out and find any work, perhaps something that holds not joy, simply to bring in money to survive.    This person takes a job that may not allow the expression of his creative urge;  one in which other people tell him what to do and how to do it, exchanging some money in exchange for his service for the purpose of making the owners of this business more money so they can enjoy the privileges of life, whilst he himself can barely make ends meet.  Again – I speak not of business operating on pure motive and which overflow their abundance with everyone within it.  These healthy businesses are good to work for and with because they allow people to contribute their own creative urge to the collective purpose.

To the person whose motive is survival, working a job which limits his creative urge may often result in resentment or depletion, lack of motivation and life energy and so on.  The life energy is bent towards survival rather than thriving and in this state, is it any wonder that there is so much social, psychological and physical illness.  Life is a meaningless existence where there is no hope, purpose or fulfilment.

Society has created so many rules and regulations and red tape for people who want to genuinely help nowadays and have not the resources (for example: to perhaps acquire a PhD for example to enable teaching) but who actually practically can create and share good works better in many cases than some who have the resources and the theoretical credentials, that it is sometimes it’s too stressful to get involved and thus share what they are good at.   E.g. The twisted motives that kill the joy, outweigh the effort it takes to get involved in the first place and so the people who can care and help the most may have neither the resources, motivation or the opportunity to do so.

A PhD for example simply tells us that a person understands the research process but not necessarily that they are even researching useful things or are even good at what they claim to do.  If for example, someone is trying to research a universal (theoretical) truth but had no (theoretical and practical) understanding of it themselves and has no idea how to do research it correctly (i.e. and therefore perhaps test it using inaccurate methodology) then this may have the effect of either misleading or misdirecting people away from a potentially useful truth, twisting the truth to fit an inaccurate interpretation, or even the outright denial of a truth altogether.

Some scientists are exceptionally pure in motive and thus contribute useful works but many are likewise skewed in motive and are producing works which only add to the confusion and may even limit constructive growth claiming more often than not that because they can’t measure something, and there is not the research evidence to back it up, that something, which may in fact be very useful, does not exist at all and therefore it is not a truth; despite all common sense to the contrary to the many who apply it successfully in day to day practice.   Again – in all of these systems it comes down to motive.

The motive of pure science from one perspective is to render the unknown, more known and thus to increasing the education and growth of the masses.  But there is still much we do not know and even much we do know from our history and philosophy of life that is useful and may not yet be adequately researched by those with the capability to actually do so.  Regardless – if we investigate motives, we can catch out the pure from the impure and perhaps be able to observe life more clearly.   Lines are easily crossed and everything we create can be used wisely to expand and enhance our awareness or unwisely to limit and confine.  It is all a matter of perspective.    To understand the root of the difficulty means we can more easily correct things without being distracted and becoming lost.

In a world of ‘creating for JOY’ everything we do leads to abundance.  We are self-sufficient and we simply share so everyone can benefit.  Yet in the world in which we now live, even in the so-called free countries (we could perhaps say relatively free – with conditions) it is getting harder and harder to be self-sufficient.  To survive own one’s own land and resources for example.   Everyone wants a cut of the profit and action.   Take for example a farmer who may have to pay the government for the privilege of using his own water.  God forbid if someone can manage to survive on his own without being entangled in the economic system at this present time.   I liken this process to a fruit tree analogy.  One tree should create an abundance of fruit for many families (who share its resources) in an ideal world.  But nowadays a greedy businessman comes along, rapes the tree of all its fruit for personal gain (starving the families who previously survived on it perhaps) and then selling it back to the same families at a cost, all in the name of economic growth.   The abundance therefore benefits the few whilst draining the many.  Motive is ‘give a little – take a lot’ (i.e. is selfish and impure).   This is not a fair energy exchange benefiting all, in my opinion.

Thus, if the motive is material acquisitions or survival, both will lead to either an over or underactive state;  one in which there is a ceaseless drive and pressure for more without sufficient rest and joy to fuel the journey (thus resulting on overwork, stress, overload, eventual collapse and fatigue) or one of depletion, of damming up, bottling and stifling the life energies (or the creative forces).  Society then suffers the consequences of this misuse, abuse, and damming of these life energies resulting in potentially many of the chronic health issues and life stresses we face today (i.e. they are the consequence of over/under use, misuse and abuse of our own creative life energies).

All of this occurs because of a forgetting of our basic motivation in life.  The joy of creating and sharing of our joyous creation for the benefit and uplift of others.

In my own case I will not compromise my basic values in life.   Thus, I will not force, coerce or manipulate people in to buying my products and services.  I will simply present and state my facts and let people work out if they want it for themselves.  All I can say is my motive is one of support and that is has worked to date for many partaking of my work.   I value things as I deem fair and to support my works and life processes and this will never be unreasonable for either myself or my clients.

Conclusion: Suggestions for a creative joyful life.

So, what are my personal suggestions to maintain honesty, integrity and joy in what we do?

First, I suggest try to find work that we love to do; Something that brings us joy in the creation and joy in the sharing.  Practice this until we do it well and it naturally overflows onto others who are attracted by it and are willing to partake of its benefits.  If we love what we are doing then and share it then it matters not whether it brings great rewards or little because one’s happiness is not valued by material gain or rewards but rather by the simple joy of creation and its sharing.  Any rewards are a bonus because its joy multiplied by the number of people sharing in it.  If even one person benefits from the sharing of a creation then it has succeeded in its purpose and is worthwhile.

Second; if we can’t perform the work we love (hopefully in the interim on our way to eventually doing something we love) either:

  1. a) Do something else (outside of work) with our spare time that we do love doing and can allow our creative energies to flow (whether it be sporting activities, hobbies, community or group service work etc). Do something that we love and in the doing of it, can also share with and uplift others. Or,
  2. b) Try to put a little joy into whatever work or activities we are doing regardless of whether it is ideal or not (i.e. make the most of it; optimise it and certainly do not make it worse for yourself and others than it otherwise needs to be).  For example, in our social interactions with others, think about how other people in our work, family or social environment are feeling, thinking or handling things.  Think about other people’s well-being and how we can perhaps create a little bit of JOY (a smile perhaps).  Create opportunities or openings for growth, encouragement and development in self and others; perhaps a supportive comment or constructive piece of advice, helping someone out when they need some help or seem to be struggling (or at least offer support unconditionally, whether the other person, of their own free will, accepts help or not – for once something is given, it is the receiver choice, whether to accept it, or to allow help, or not when it comes).   Remember that sharing of anything we create should be a ‘win-win’ situation not a ‘win-lose’ or ‘lose-win’ situation so practice win-win situations, spreading a little health and well-being instead of despair and discouragement.

In my view health should be just as catchy as disease?  We only need to practice this until we perfect it.  It all depends upon what you put out there and practice (and thus get good at).  Fear or love, anger or peace, error or truth; confusion or clarity; destruction or construction of truth, love, selfish benefit or mutual benefit, etc.  When someone is unhealthy, has a cold perhaps, why instead of saying “keep your distance – I don’t want to catch your cold can’t we say, hear – share a little bit of my health which is overflowing and just waiting to be happily received?”  Practice makes perfect.  To one who has mastered the art of sharing health, for example, dis-ease is highly unlikely to enter (or be allowed) in.  This overflowing with health encourages a healthier immunity and resistance to disease in whatever form it may come – physical, energetic, emotional or mental.

Whether we are able to do what we love or not, by optimising any life situation we find ourselves in (i.e. by not making it worse than it is and thus feed the ‘DIS-ease’ rather than the ‘EASE’) then we will at the very least, not take our personal issues out on others and thus share our suffering with them.  Sharing the dis-ease and suffering merely drags others into our ‘quicksand of sorrow’ with us (if they allow or succumb this of course; being sucked into it via mental or emotional manipulation etc).  Instead, make the most of what we have and do what we can to alleviate distress and dis-ease and make things a little easier for others, to lift them out of the quicksand of their suffering, even if we can’t do the same thing for ourselves.   Bringing out some joy in others may just bring out some small measure of JOY in ourselves (through the sharing of helpful thoughts, feelings and deeds) and thus may (even if only a very little) improve one’s own creative life energies and their outflow.

Consider one final thought on this topic.  If we ask ourselves: “What is our real work from a motivation and quality perspective?” for example.  What is our best quality that we put into everything we do in life (work, home, activities, life)?  If we can identify this it may give us an idea about what we are really good at (or are developing in this life).  E.g. is it in communication, being loving, wise, honest, sincere, optimistic, uplifting, adaptable, etc.   If we can work out what qualities we are good at (or want to be good at) in ourselves then this may just help with working out what career opportunities may well provide the environment for their optimal growth and thus give some clue to what we really do love doing and can put our joy into in order to keep our motives pure.   The other option is to get caught up in skewed motives through ignoring the inner creative urges wanting to break free from within and working instead for (or being distracted by the temptation of) money, prestige, a house or any other acquisitions which may or may not necessarily be in synchronicity with our inner life energies and purpose.

The motto here is “share, receive, fill up with and overflow and spread JOY (health, love, wisdom, understanding or any other healthy beneficial quality in life)”

Tap into our own inner creative energies first, then create something and see what happens.  As the creative river flows, like a physical river, it will forge a natural path in the environment (in the external world) and in the observing (through inner and outer self-reflection and contemplation) of this flow (and its direction) we will likely find our outer life path also.

If the inner self and outer self are in alignment then external life and health will be also and our motives will remain honest, sincere and pure – for the mutual benefit of all.

???? Paul Turner.  26/4/2019